1936 MG: The Frailty of Peace Sign-Up Thread

[acecipher]

It is now the Year 1936, and after near 20 years of peace, the unresolved tensions of the past hundred years--truly only pasted over by the Great War--again bear their head. Every continent again stands on the brink of war--the ultimate end of Europe's long histories of colonialism and political interference since their discovery of the "New World," and subsequent colonization--later followed by powers within the Middle Eastern, Chinese, and Indian spheres--of course, once disease had ravaged both continents, even though the New World was clearly in worse shape than the Old.

Manufacturing outputs are ramped up as new technologies are developed, militias drill in fields as miners dig underneath the earth for new, rare metals vital to the new weapons of war. The last conflict invented horrors enough for several generations, and created meat-grinders that showed men the most ardent horrors war had to offer: mankind only can fear and tremble at what kind of new destruction this future conflict will hold....

So, in the attempt to start a map game, I shall open claims, copying Seren's format from "The War To End All Wars?".

Extra Bonus points (that get you no in-game advantage) for making a good claim as to how the altered flow of disease (namely, less devestating in the New world than OTL) slowed European (and Middle Eastern, and Indian, and Chinese) colonization and shifted the power to make a more.... Interesting New World. Throwing in nice details about economic resource exploitation and technological progress over time, especially in new and exciting ways, is always encouraged.

• 2-3 claims each
• PODs no earlier than 1492
• While large territorial empires and populous nations are not.... discouraged, they may be subject to GM approval. However, Bioregionalism (or reasons for its transgressions) will be looked upon more favorably.
• No 3 claims may all be on the same continent--This is to encourage Colonization and development.
• Each nation may (optionally) make a claim to a colony in some other part of the world. Plausibility will limit this--IE Finland cannot conquer Beijing from China to set up a trading port there, especially without logistics. GM reserves the right to revoke this in case abuse becomes rampant.
• For simplicity's sake, and to keep the premise of a WWII analogue somewhat plausible, assume that there has been similar eras of development and technologic advance throughout history: the evolution towards firearms, a Liberal period of Enlightenment, followed by an Industrial Revolution (culminating in the political crisis/crises that led to the Great War).

Claims Format:

Nation Name:
OTL Area:
Rough population in millions:
Summary:
Map: (SMALL map, cut to just show nation claim, not the whole map. Saved in PNG format - try to avoid right-angles in your border corners, also, as they're ugly. OTL 1925 map in the same projection is available on request, for those who need help with borders.)

Forum downsizes. Right click, View Image.


Example:

Nation Name: Bullshit Empire of Exampleopia
OTL Area: OTL Somalia/Ethiopia region, Horn of Africa
Rough population in millions: 20.5 million
Summary: So the Solomonic Dynasty 'westernised' somehow in the 17th century and became a major civilised power in the Indian Ocean. As they viewed themselves as an example to the world, they renamed their nation Exampleopia.
Map:

[Azagal]

I retract my claims.

[Smyg]

I am deeply saddened by DutchGuy’s claims on my homeland.

Will think of something.

[Smyg]

First claim: All of modern day Angola, parts of Congo, parts of Gabon, bits of northern Namibia, TBD. The Kongo

Second claim which I don’t care much for but can fall back to if people really want that first area: The Russian Republic, its origins to be found in the Times of Trouble. The Tsars of old never fully achieved neither Baltic control or dominion over Crimea, leading to a heavy focus eastwards. Siberia has been settled to a higher degree as well-built railroads crisscross one of the greatest natural resource bounties known to man, Vladivostok is a significant artery of trade between the Pacific and Europe, and Alaska is still Russian territory.

[Huojin]

I reject claims as map-based imperialism. Give me maps or give me death.

Anyway, India. Assuming for the time being that the East India Company comes into existence and takes over India, though obviously workable if people have differing ideas on Europe.

Nation Name: Confederacy of India/Empire of India
OTL Area: Indian subcontinent, potentially spreading into parts of Afghanistan and Burma, potentially including Sri Lanka.
Rough population in millions: 350 million
Summary: Bahadur Shah II, Mughal Emperor, dies in early 1857 shortly before the start of the Sepoy Mutiny. His son, Mirza Mughal, succeeds him as Muhammad Shah II. When the mutiny breaks out, unlike his father, Muhammad Shah II seizes the chance to side with the rebels. Bakht Khan becomes leader of the rebel forces, endorsed by the newly hailed Emperor of India, and takes a series of initial steps (such as systematically destroying telegraph lines and railways) that hinders the East India Company’s ability to react. A handful of battles are won by the rebels initially, allowing them to build momentum and legitimacy that strengthens the poorly organised revolt. When confronted with Presidency Armies, mutinies occur in staggering numbers.

The war lasts six years, with several million dead (not just in the fighting but in the famines that also result) as the British and their allied native states and armies attempt to pacify the subcontinent. Finally a peace is struck and the British withdraw from the continent, propping up a number of puppets and princely states in their wake.

The following 70+ years are turbulent for India. A barely held together “nation”, it soon becomes apparent that the Mughal Emperors are once more little but a figure head behind a North Indian central government, it’s legitimacy rooted in military power. The new government may have united India, but finds itself continually powerless to prevent foreign exploitation, as the rest of the world continues to take advantage of the weak central government to broker deals with warlords and nobles who, though loyal to the Empire, are equally willing to grapple economically and diplomatically amongst each other. It has been years since internal fighting broke out proper, but rebellion seethes beneath the surface.
Map:

[Gesar]

Claiming North America west and north of the Mississippi-Missouri, with a colony in Kamchatka if Smyg is down, as well as the historic Omani empire extended into IRL Somalia/Yemen with a colony in the modern day Malaya area+Maluku Islands.

[Huojin]

Also I’ve got stuff for China below Ges and I worked on before, unless someone else has ideas that they want to do that aren’t really stupid~

Nation Name: Zhonghua Minguo (Republic of China)
OTL Area: Southern China
Rough population in millions: 295 million (northern China approx 155 million)
Summary: During peasant revolts threatening Beijing and the Qing armies bearing down on northern China, the Chongzhen Emperor consents to relocating the Imperial Court to Nanjing. The Royal Family remains in the north nonetheless, and when Li Zicheng seized the city, they either died or committed suicide. At the Battle of Shanhai Pass, Ming General Wu Sangui refuses to open the pass to the Qing, defeating both the Shun Dynasty army and repulsing the Qing, setting back their advance. When the Qing finally reached Beijing, with the court in the south and the new Hongguan Emperor ruling, they arrested the spread of the Qing Dynasty, resulting in the lengthy survival of the Southern Ming Dynasty. Years of wars and dynastic interplay ensue over the years, as well as fighting colonialism. After a recent war begun by the Ming prior to the Great War (1900ish) which resulted in a depressing status quo ante bellum but with major loss of life, popular revolt overthrew the Emperors and began the Republic.

Nation Name: Great Qing/Chinese Empire
OTL Area: Northern China+Mongolia+Russian Manchuria and Kazakhstan
Rough population in millions: 155 Miillion
Summary: With the survival of the Southern Ming, a series of lengthy and protracted wars left China divided in two. Rather than wither as yet another barbarian would-be conqueror, the Manchu Qing adapted quickly, reforming the Eight Banners and adopting an ethnic system to ensure their survival in further conflicts with the "southern warlords". A series of wars in the 19th century led to even further reforms and a brief period of crash modernization, in which the Emperor restored his own power against the Bannermen. This, perhaps, led to a period of internal strife under the Empress Dowager and her successors, culiminating in a recent power struggle which left the xenophobic court party secure but unsympathetic to most foreigners. The fact that Great Qing, now the Chinese Empire, has recently emerged from a bloody Pyrrhic victory with their southern neighbors with the militaristic court faction firmly entrenched has done little to alleviate these misgivings.

Northern Orange-Yellow is the Great Qing. Korea comes under their sphere of influence, unless people want to fuck with that.

Southern Blue is the Republic (former Ming).

Tibet exists in its reclusive theocracy, previously under the suzerainty of the Ming, now nominally part of the Republic but independent for all intents and purposes.

I had a theory for Taiwan as being a form of the Kingdom of Tungning - formerly a Ming tributary, but having drifted from its influence in recent years, falling under the partial sway of the Ryukyu Kingdom, but this is also based on whether or not RinKou resubmits my favourite idea of his, the Cipan Free States, so that the two have something to clash over. If anyone wants it, feel free.

In Indochina, I can’t be fucked to change the map - do what you like, people.

[Huojin]

Added a map for India. Note that it doesn't include any foreign coastal enclaves like Goa, Pondicherry, etc., but I am absolutely not opposed to their inclusion - in fact it makes loads of sense. So if anyone wants to get in on that, feel free.

[Orago]

Nation Name: Empire of Morocco
OTL Area: Traditional Morocco, Most of the Maghreb (Modern Algeria and Tunisia)
Rough population in millions: 7 million
Summary: Near the dawn of the 18th century, Morocco was ruled by the greatest of sultans from the Alaouite dynasty. Sultan Moulay Ismail ibn Sherif is historically considered to have been a very powerful ruler that successfully united the various tribes of Morocco and reigned in a very centralized manner. He secured his nation's sovereignty from the Ottoman Empire with a series of defensive victories. However, in 1698 in a rather bold move, the Moroccan Sultan decided to chase an Ottoman retreat and go on the offensive, launching several incursions into loosely held Ottoman Maghreb territories with Ismail's sizable Black Guard, a force of sub-Saharan slave warriors. Eventually, at the risk of losing even more prestige and territory than they already have, the Ottomans declared their peace and ceded territory to the Moroccan Sultanate.

Moulay Ismail endured a lengthy reign historically, and in this timeline he too had a long life. He had time to stabilize the lands he has conquered and built the most prestigious Islamic university outside of Istanbul in Marrakesh. Historically, Moulay Ismail's successors and the rest of the Alaouite dynasty after his death were less than stellar. In this timeline, while not as legendary, most of Morocco's rulers were up to the challenge of governing this newly formed empire. Morocco became known to the Europeans as an Islamic state that could look out after itself. That reputation only grew as Morocco continued to initiate more internal reforms. This included a crack down and disbandment of the various Barbary pirate strongholds along the Magreb coast. As Ottoman power declined over the following centuries, Morocco became looked at as one of the renowned predominantly Muslim states. The nation engaged in diplomacy and trade with the Europeans and other Greatpowers, maintaining it's status as a legitimate and "Westernized" nation until the present day.

During the late 18th and 19th centuries, Morocco gravitated towards a sort of Enlightened Islamic Constitutional Monarchism, developing a parliament and taking on a more open and free political atmosphere. Morocco was still very much an Islamic state though, not nearly as secular as the Ottoman Empire.

During the 20th century Morocco was not looked at as a "primitive" African country to subjugate by the Europeans, but the southern equivalent of the Ottoman Empire. They maintained that rivalry with the Ottomans throughout their history, and due to their particular closeness and trade relations with France and Britain, were at war against the Central Powers during the Great War.

Today, internal issues can include growing resentment towards European powers that undoubtedly have their eyes set on this now stagnant empire.

Morocco was well respected enough during the 1700s. They traded with Europe and held off Ottoman expansion. I thought it would be cool to take it further and have a Magreb empire in this timeline. A Muslim power bordering Europe that rivals the Ottoman Empire. I think that's a cool dynamic.

Nation Name: Republic of Sardinia-Tuscany
OTL Area: Tuscany (Central Italy, above Rome and south of Seren's claims) & Sardinia, as well as the Tuscan West Indies (St. Jan, St. Croix, St. Thomas, sold by Denmark)
Rough Population: 2 million
Summary: The affluent and wealthy Medici family of Florence saw the region prosper throughout the Renaissance. While they maintained a fierce rivalry with their fellow Italian state of Venice, the Venetian territorial conquests acted as a sort of buffer against other great powers. Florence used its prosperity to hire vast armies of mercenaries to safeguard its sovereignty, as well as to expand the Republic to encompass all of the Tuscan region, also later annexing the island of Sardinia.

The small but wealthy Italian Republic used its wealth to purchase the Danish West Indies from Denmark during the 19th century. (Denmark historically sold them to the United States, Tuscany bid higher).

With northern Italy firmly secured by the Venetians, and the rest of Italy also stabilized by their respective governments, Italian unification never happened.

Today, the Republic of Sardinia is quite the open and democratic society, granting many of its citizens personal liberties. The banking and industrial sector are still existent (far more industrialized than the Kingdom of Two-Sicilies to the south, although the economy is struggling much like everywhere post-Great War.

With this claim, I decided to make Tuscany a state capable of staying independent while also being wealthy enough to take a modest role in the late colonial game. Tuscany is far from a great power or empire, but I thought I'd fill a void. Maybe I'll flush out more details later.

Nation Name: Kingdom of Two-Sicilies
OTL Area: Southern Italy, Sicily, Libya
Rough Population: 3 million
Summary: Departing from real history sometime during the middle of the 19th century, the Kingdom of Two-Sicilies is one of the regional Italian powers. Much more rural, agrarian, and conservative than northern parts of Italy, the Two-Sicilies is also much more poor. The post war depression hit the Two-Sicilies especially hard, and anti-monarchy protests are common, as colonial Libya yearns for independence, supported by Morocco. As the least respected of the three powers occupying Italy, they are natural rivals of both Venice and Tuscany.

I am modeling this nation after the historical Two-Sicilies. Again, just filling a space on the map. I can flush it out more later. But I think a non-unified Italy is cool and adds an interesting dynamic to a possible WW2.



Those are my 3 claims! If I'm overstepping anyone else's, let me know.

[Master of Oblivion]

1. Claiming Spain
2. Claiming Israel


Also including Seren's Venice for my own Sanity.

[Master of Oblivion]

Name: Holy See
OLT: Sinai Peninsula, Israel/Palestine, Lebanon, parts of Syria, Rome
Population: 6 Million
Summary: The Christian forces of Spain, Portugal, and the Italian states relentlessly attacked the forces of Islam in the Mediterranean. After winning the decisive battle of Lepanto, the Holy League continued its assault on the Turks, and bombarded Istanbul. This was coupled with a land invasion, with the Catholics fashioned as a new crusade. Though the Christian forces were bogged down and outnumbered, the Turks suffered from continued Christian naval assaults and blockades. Coupled with invasions by the Austrians and Persians, the Ottomans agreed to hand over the Holy land.

Under the technical auspices of the Catholic Church, this new territory was administered by the successor of St. Peter himself. In actuality it was ruled by Italian and Spanish lords and oligarchs, who had divided the holy land up into new fiefdoms. Power was split between the temporal and spiritual, with the Pope and the Council of Notables sharing power. Throughout the 1600's and 1700's wars were waged by the Ottomans to retake this territory. Each time the Holy land was saved by a pious Christian nation, fighting against the Turks. A notable feature of the Holy See was the emergence of Latin literature, much of it exploring the Bible or themes in Phoenician Mythology.

The economy of the Holy See of Jerusalem depending upon the production of wine, olives, and other crops. Likewise the influx of pilgrims to holy sites provided a great source of funds for the country. However during the 1800's it was noticeable that that economy of the Holy See was lagging behind. The massive landed estates, religious caste system, and weak government provided no incentives for industrialization. Efforts to modernize or liberalize were shot down by the church and nobles as violating religion or the cross.

During the 20th century the Holy See is wracked by instability. Land inequality is rife with a new nobles controlling great estates, and the rest of the population living in squalor. Likewise much land is held by the Church, with its wealth being utilized to serve the needs of the faith across the globe. Muslim and Jewish insurgents seek to liberate their homeland. Likewise the Pope and Council of Notables stand divided over questions of power and reformation. Can the Holy See survive?

[CarpeVerpa]

If I can, I'd like to stake the following claim.

Nation Name: Irish Republic
OTL Area: Ireland
Rough population in millions: ~9 million
Summary: What was now known as the Irish Republic began with an island-wide revolt against English rule in the late 1500s, in response to attempts to increase and centralize control of the island. Foreign help would see to an Irish victory, and the English eventually being kickced off the island. Though reconquest attempts would be made, they were half-hearted, as the former masters of Ireland had bigger concerns elsewhere. From there, Ireland began the slow process of unification and centralization. In the late 1600s, a King of Ireland would be declared, and centralization under this crown would continue at a slow pace until the flames of revolution came to Ireland in the early 1800s, toppling the monarchy and seeing a republic replace it.

Ireland has always been insular since it's independence, only looking outward to court the favor of potential protectors. With the coming of the Industrial Revolution, Ireland began a process of mechanization and industrialization that, while not making Ireland stand out, has
Map:

Nation Name: Indigenous Federation
OTL Area: Great Lakes region
Rough population in millions: ~12 million
Summary: Originally, what became known as the Indigenous Federation was the Iroquois Confederacy. As European settlers arrived on the continent and began to displace the natives, however, the Iroquois slowly adopted the mantle of a unified native polity. Managing to stake out defined borders through negotiation and deals with the Europeans, and beginning to create European-style institutions to protect and enforce these borders, the Confederacy began to welcome other indigenous peoples into their land as a safe haven, settling them and providing them places in society.

European-style reforms defined much of the history of the Confederacy, as its leaders attempted to learn and emulate what made the overseas visitors so powerful. Trades would be made for technology, advisors, and resources to begin massive developments of society. This would result in, among other points, a population boom with the adoption of more sophisticated agricultural methods. Eventually, the reforms came to ahead, with the reformation of the Iroquois Confederacy into an Indigenous Federation, at once solidifying an indigenous identity and centralizing the government to increase efficency. Though tribal identities would still exist, the government would not consider them in how it was organized and run, but instead rely on mostly artificial geographical subdivisions and elections to determine the affairs of government. In addition, efforts would be made to introduce a national language for use alongside tribal languages, based primarily on various Iroquoian languages and the Latin alphabet. Known as Indigenous Common or North American, it has mostly taken the place of the official working language of the state by 1936, though most people speak their tribe's language, many even only speaking Indigenous Common as a second language.
Map:

Nation Name: Great Arabic State
OTL Area: Egypt sans Venetian and Holy See-controlled areas and a good portion of the Arabian peninsula
Rough population in millions: ~12 million
Summary: The Great Arabic State can trace itself back to the Mamluk Sultanate, which had itself been overthrown due to popular discontent in the mid 1600s. The Mamluk state would be replaces with a new dynasty, though it would never enjoy any high degree of popularity of support. Still, it managed to consolidate some power, and even introduced various reforms and advancements to Egypt, which allowed it to retain independence against any would-be invaders, and even managed to expand authority among the Arabian tribes.

With the rise of radical new ideologies in the early 1900s, however, popular discontent would again formulate. This time, the monarchy would be toppled by a group calling themselves the Arabic League, espousing a mix of Islamism, pan-Arabism, and new western authoritarian ideas. They would subsequently remake Egypt as the Great Arabic state and move the capital to Mecca. They now lay claim to the entire Arabic world, and perhaps even beyond.
Map:

[Luc]

Full Map

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Nation Name: Republic of Cuba (Poblacht na Talún Torthúil)
OTL Area: Cuba
Rough population in millions: ~5.6 million
Summary: Originally a colony of the Irish Kingdom, it would break away to form an independent republic following the destruction of the Irish Monarchy in the early 1800's. Despite forming a parliamentary republic, the government would become an extremely nationalistic one bound together by a series of racial laws that prioritized the Irish population while leaving those related to enslaved Africans or the islands indigenous population with very scarce rights. While there was some minimal improvement, such as the abolition of slavery and laws that allowed minorities the right to own land, the island is essentially still under an apartheid state with minorities being constantly repressed and having their political and land ownership rights severely limited. While there were attempts at industrializing, the core of the Island's economic heart lies in its bountiful agriculture.




Nation Name: Federal Republic of Germany
OTL Area: Germany, Austria and Western Poland
Rough population in millions: ~77 million
Summary: The old Holy Roman Empire would be rocked to the core by the instability brought forth by the industrial revolution, which would result in the destruction of the monarchy and the formation of a central European confederation of states. As the century progressed, the old governments would crumble giving way for new, more democratic ones, at the same time increasing centralization, that ultimately led to the formation of the Republic formed by the Germanic nations of the Confederation. With its capital in Berlin, it is a heavily industrialized nation, led by one of the most democratic governments in Europe. While centralization has been increasing over the past few decades, the regional governments still have a good degree of autonomy to address local issues.

[acecipher]

Progress Update:

The map is well underway, progress can be seen here. Several things have emerged, We've got several long stretches of territory , but still got enough area that things still are well open for development:

(This is still sized-down)

So, first, a note on Nationbuilding: It has come to my attention that the Thirty Year's War likely ended up being held a bit further.... West than historically happened, and managed to devestate large swaths of France. So if someone wants to develop a Big Blue Blob, expect it to be a bit... toasty (as well as having had a hard time with some colonies).
Speaking of colonies, there are Six Times as many natives in the US as historically. So, populations are a bit.... big. (And that's still with 40% of them dying off.)

All the above posted nations are accepted, with priority on explicitly claimed lands. Several have been expanded (Florence, the Iroquois, etc). This isn't to say that there can't be claims cut down (especially with permission) to allow for other ideas (GREAT RYUKU), but will be given.... extra weight in my attempts to weigh claims vs each other (and who stole what land from whom).

Also, I'll be introducing some Colonial Priority, to note which powers were able to arrive the firstest and hardest. This isn't set in stone and can't be altered, but there are some emergent colonial powers. A very rough list:

• GREATER RYUKU
• Portugal
• Venice
• Ireland
• Scotland
• Oman
• Indigenous claims/Successor states (Snack's WIP, Cuba, Core territory of nations)
• India
• France
• Republic of China
• Metis
• Germany
• Kongo
• Qing
• 2 Sicilies
• Popeman
• England
• Theodoro (YOU ARE LITERALLY IN THE BLACK SEA, DINO) (ALSO THERE I FIXED IT)

In addition, some members have expressed claims that they haven't written up or done maps for, these include:

• Flaming Bolshevik making Great Khorosan (a Zoroastrian Kingdom) in the Steppe and Iran
• Maddox with Gran Colombia
• Snacks with the Atlantic Coast federation

(If I've forgotten anyone poke me on discord and I'll add you)

Some nations have just kind of... happened, and need adoption:

Nations we need:
GREATER RYUKU

Nations it would be cool to have:
-Scotland
-Switzerland
-Yemen
-Vietnam/Laos/Cambodia

Nations we probably will ignore:
-Nepal
-Bhutan
-

Besides those we need, borders are also negotiable for these nations, and things can be carved out from them.

Some people owe me writeups, I won't call you out here but you know who you are and you should do the writeup.

[profesoradino2]

I NEVER CLAIMED I WAS BYZANTIUM I SAID I WAS THEODORO YOU MADE THAT UP FAKE NEWS